Month 2:27, Week 4:5 (Chamashee/Teruah), Year 5935:054 AM|
Gregorian Calendar: Monday 30 May 2011
3 Days and 3 Nights
Was Yah'shua in the
Tomb for 72 Hours?
6 December 2011
Great theological errors have been made in the past because Westerners have not understood the cultural context of the Bible writings or they have not understood the difference between the literal and the poetic. Accordingly, there are those who believe Yah'shua (Jesus) taught us to hate people, those who think Yahweh has feathers, and those who think Yah'shua (Jesus) was in the grave for 72 hours and in consequence have concluded that the Creation Calendar cannot possibly be correct.
"Then some of the scribes and Pharisees answered, saying, 'Teacher, we want to see a sign from You.' But He answered and said to them, 'An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. The men of Nineveh will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and indeed a greater than Jonah is here. The queen of the South will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, for she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and indeed a greater than Solomon is here'" (Matt.12:38-42, NKJV).
The usual assumption, in reading today's passage, is that in the same way Jonah was in the belly of the whale for 72 hours, so Yah'shua (Jesus) was in the grave or "heart of the earth" for 72 hours too, and that this was the sign that He gave to the unbelieving Torah-teachers (scribes) and Pharisees.
Firstly, as you will see in a moment, the sign Yah'shua (Jesus) gave to the religious teachers of His day had nothing to do with any duration of time in any grave. Did Jonah give as a sign to the Ninevehites the fact that he was 72 hours in a whale? Nineveh was about 600 miles from the shore when Jonah was spewed out on the beach of the eastern Miditerranean and there is no evidence that this tale was retold to them, or that it played any part in their repentance - rather, the "sign" was the message of repentance (compare Mt.12 with Lk.11:29-32). Why should Jonah's sojourn in a whale's belly cause them to repent, let alone believe him? Jonah's message to Ninevah was, as Yah'shua's (Jesus') was to the Judeans, "REPENT OR PERISH", and that is what caused them to repent! They wanted to save their lives and couldn't have cared a fig about some foreigner taking a ride in the belly of a sea creature, miraculous though it was. Jonah's repentance didn't interest them but the message of repentance he brought to them. The Ninevehites repented en masse but few of the Torah-teachers and Pharisees did. This was the sign of the Prophet Jonah, just as it was of the Son of Man - if you don't repent, you will die - and it's the same message to us today:
How many people do you know of who were converted to Messiah because of Jonah being 72 hours in a whale's stomach? Or even of Yah'shua being in a grave for 72 hours? On this occasion Yah'shua (Jesus) was not talking about His death and resurrection, was He? If He had been, He would also have mentioned the fact that He would be coming out of the grave too, wouldn't He - a rather important point! What convinced His talmidim or disciples that He was Messiah was not that He died and was burried but the fact that He AROSE! And as Muslims rightly point out, Jonah did not actually die in the whale and therefore when he was spat out, he was not restored to life in such a way that could be compared with death and resurrection. This particular sign has nothing to do with the resurrection! It's all about repentance - Jonas', for running away from Yahweh's call, and the religious leaders of Yah'shua's (Jesus') day for running away from the Emet (Truth) which was Yah'shua (Jesus) and nothing more. But unlike Jonah, who repented, the religious leaders (for the most part) did not.
"I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish" (Luke 13:3, NKJV).
Secondly, the phrase "three days and three nights" is a Hebrew idiom - it's not describing an exact 72-hour period of time. If it were, and we are to understand it literally, Yah'shua (Jesus) would not have risen on the "third day" but on the fourth. Scripture is plain:
The Hebrew idiom "three days and three nights" means simply 'a period of time that covers parts of 3 days'. It may begin the last 5 hours of the 1st day, then include all 24 of the 2nd, and end after 4 hours into the 3rd day. But if we interpret it according to our manner of speaking today, we usually think it must mean 3 complete day cycles of 24 hours each. Yet, this is just how the Hebrews reckoned "days".
"From that time Yah'shua (Jesus) began to show to His talmidim (disciples) that He must go to Jerusalem, and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised the third day" (Matt.16:21, NKJV).
In the time of Esther, we see the same idiom used and it clearly does not include all 72 hours of "three days and three nights":
The literal interpretation of this passage is that Esther, her maidens and all the Judahites were to fast for three complete days and nights, or 72 hours, and THEN she would "go to the king". Yet, we learn that she appeared before the king "on the third day":
"Go, gather all the Judahites who are present in Shushan, and fast for me; neither eat nor drink for three days, night or day. My maids and I will fast likewise. And so I will go to the king, which is against the law; and if I perish, I perish!" (Est 4:16-17, NKJV).
Any time during the third day would be less than 72 hours and hence she and her maidens did not fast for 3 days and 3 nights otherwise Esther would have been forced to visit the king on the fourth day. Dr. John D. Morris, speaking of the whale incident with Jonah, says:
"Now it came to pass on the third day, that Esther put on her royal apparel, and stood in the inner court of the king's house, over against the king's house: and the king sat upon his royal throne in the royal house, over against the gate of the house. And it was so, when the king saw Esther the queen standing in the court, that she obtained favour in his sight: and the king held out to Esther the golden sceptre that was in his hand. So Esther drew near, and touched the top of the sceptre" (Est.5:1-2, KJV).
There are others defending the Creation Calendar who argue that "heart of the earth" is another idiom like "in the midst of the earth (or sea or fire)" (Gen.48:16; Ex.8:22; Ps.74:12; Dan.4:19; Dt.4:36; Prov.30:18-19) that means something else, but I remain to be convinced. In our main passage of the day, Yah'shua (Jesus) is saying that just as He will be dead for "three days and three nights" (which as we have seen does not necessarily mean 72 hours) so the Pharisees and Torah-teachers will die too. Yah'shua (Jesus) says nothing about the glory of His resurrection because these false teachers won't be sharing in it! They will remain in the "heart of the earth" as He did for perhaps anything up to 3,000 years, since one day to Yahweh is as 1,000 years to man (2 Pet.3:8). Likewise, Jonah had to remain in the belly of the whale for up to three days until he repented!
"The Hebrew idiom "three days and three nights" has been clearly shown both from Scripture and other sources to mean a period of time beginning on one day and ending on the day after the one following. It doesn't necessarily mean three full days and nights".
Which brings us back to the Creation Calendar. Messianics who still follow the Roman Calendar like Christians criticise Christians who claim that Yah'shua (Jesus) was buried on 'Good Friday' and rose on 'Easter Sunday', pointing out that this is not three whole days (72 hours). Like the Armstrongites, messianics argue instead that Pesach (Passover) must have been on a 'Wednesday' but are then forced to make the resurrection minutes after sundown on the Sabbath (Aviv 17) when the Scripture plainly said that it took place shortly before dawn:
In order to get a full "three days and three nights" (72 hours) into this doctrine, Yah'shua (Jesus) would have to have been resurrected at the same time as He was buried three days later. But this did not happen because the burial took place at sunset with the resurrection occuring at dawn. Understanding the 'weekend' of the crucifixion in this manner causes a critical problem., for whilst it is correctly said that the Sabbath came right after Pesach (Passover) on Aviv 15, or the first day of Chag haMatzah (Unleavened Bread), it forces Aviv 17 to become some spurious 'weekly' Sabbath after which would follow resurrection 'Sunday' (Aviv 18).
"Now after the Sabbath, as the first day of the week began to dawn, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary came to see the tomb" (Matt.28:1, NKJV).
Let us assume that this 'week sabbath' is correct. How can we disprove it? Simple. Count back 7 days and you arrive at what day? Aviv 10. If they are right then Aviv 10 must be a sabbath! Right? Wrong! What was Aviv 10 for? Every year, on the 10th day of Aviv, Israel was commanded to go into the field and select the Passover lamb, and set it aside. Those who did not have livestock went to the temple on that day and bought a sacrifice. Buying and selling is prohibited on the Sabbath! Therefore Aviv 17 could not have been a Sabbath!
Nowhere in Scripture is Aviv 17 ever called a Sabbath. And Aviv 10 couldn't have been. Actually, Aviv 10 is a commanded day of work!
If you read Leviticus 23 you will discover that Pesach (Passover) is on Aviv 14 and the Sabbath is the following day on Aviv 15, so the morning after the Sabbath is Aviv 16.
"Speak to all the congregation of Israel, saying: 'On the tenth day of this [first] month (Aviv) every man shall take for himself a lamb, according to the house of his father, a lamb for a household. And if the household is too small for the lamb, let him and his neighbour next to his house take it according to the number of the persons; according to each man's need you shall make your count for the lamb. Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year. You may take it from the sheep or from the goats. Now you shall keep it until the fourteenth day of the same month. Then the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it at twilight" (Ex.12:3-6, NKJV).
Now either you believe the Torah or man-made Jewish and Messianic traditions. The resurrection took place on Aviv 16 in the B'rit Chadashah Scriptures (New Testament) if you believe the Tanakh (Old Testament). And if you believe in the Tanakh (Old Testament) then you have no choice but to accept the Creation Calendar for if you accept any other calendar you will be forced to bend the Scriptures out of shape and change their plain meaning to make any other calendar 'work'.
Yah'shua (Jesus) was indeed "in the heart of the earth" for "three days and three nights" but not for 72 hours. He arose just before dawn on the "third day", as Scripture testifies. No twisting of Scripture is needed to come to this conclusion but you do need to have an understanding of Hebraic idiomatic speech.
This was the last issue that held me back from accepting the Creation Calendar since everything else lined up plainly with it in Scripture. I pray that it will resolve it finally for you too. Amen.
 Mary Nell Wyatt, Insights into Biblical Understanding: The Mark of the Beast vs. the Seal of God
 Dr. John D. Morris, Did Jonah Really Get Swallowed by a Whale?
 Troy Miller, FAQ's About the Creator's Calendar
Some of our readers have had problems adjusting their thinking to the Creation Calendar when it comes to the fixed positioning of Yom haBikkurim on Aviv 16 as this festival 'moves about' because of the need by the Talmudists not to have two sabbaths in a row in their hybrid Roman-Hebrew calendar. In the Creation Calendar Yom haBikkurim is a permenantly fixed natural sabbath, not an 'extra' 'High Sabbath'.
A second problem those raised in the Catholic, Protestant and Orthodox traditions is that they have come to believe the error that Yah'shua (Jesus) was in the grave for 3 days and 3 nights. This concept is so deeply embedded in Christian culture that it is hard for them to adjust to purely Hebraic thinking on the matter. As shown in the article above, though, two things must be born in mind:
All the scriptures pertaining to the duration of Yah'shua's (Jesus') time in the grave say that He would arise - or had already arisen - on the third day (that is, Day #3) and do not say He was in the grave for three days and three nights. Let us review these:
- 1. '3 days and 3 nights' is a Hebrew idiom that does not necessarily - and does not usually mean - a 72 hour period, as I have demonstrated; and
- 2. The Jonah Prophecy has nothing to do with Yah'shua's (Jesus') duration in the grave, as also demonstrated.
None of the scriptures say "after three days" or "after three days and three nights" He would "rise again". They always say "on the third day" or "on day number three". All the Scripture writers, including Yah'shua (Jesus) Himself, are unanimous in this and consistent. They all say the same thing. The chart below explains what happened for clarity's sake:
"Behold, we are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be betrayed to the chief priests and to the scribes; and they will condemn Him to death, and deliver Him to the Gentiles to mock and to scourge and to crucify. And the third day He will rise again" (Matt.20:17-19, NKJV).
"For He taught His disciples and said to them, 'The Son of Man is being betrayed into the hands of men, and they will kill Him. And after He is killed, He will rise the third day'" (Mark 9:30-31, NKJV).
"Behold, we are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be betrayed to the chief priests and to the scribes; and they will condemn Him to death and deliver Him to the Gentiles; 34 and they will mock Him, and scourge Him, and spit on Him, and kill Him. And the third day He will rise again" (Mark 10:33-34, NKJV).
"For He will be delivered to the Gentiles and will be mocked and insulted and spit upon. They will scourge Him and kill Him. And the third day He will rise again" (Luke 18:32-33, NKJV)
"He is not here, but is risen! Remember how He spoke to you when He was still in Galilee, saying, 'The Son of Man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again.' And they remembered His words" (Luke 24:6-8, NKJV).
"Then He said to them, 'Thus it is written, and thus it was necessary for the Messiah (Christ) to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day, and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem'" (Luke 24:45-47, NKJV).
I realise this upsets centuries of tradition but the emet (truth) is the emet (truth), just like so many other traditions we have had to discard because of Romanism. We have been so brainwashed by the '3 days and 3 nights' myth that anything which doesn't line up with it throws us off. "But you can only get two nights and one day out of it!!!" someone recently protested. Yes indeed (though actually a little over one day) - that's exactly how long the Messiah was in the grave.
But what about the temple prophecy Yah'shua (Jesus) made, and all the fuss the religious authorities made about that?
Before I comment on this, bear in mind that had Yah'shua (Jesus) actually been in the tomb for three days and three nights (72 hours), as Roman tradition teaches, that He would have arisen on the fourth day, and not the third. If we look at the Greek at face value - treis hemera - then we could either be looking at three 24 hours periods or the time space between dawn and dark. So this could either mean 3 full 24 hours periods or a time period within three days. We have to make a choice. Since Yah'shua (Jesus) could not have been in the tomb three whole days without not rising on the fourth day, we are obliged for consistency to adopt the second interpretation. So when Yah'shua (Jesus) prophesied that He would rebuild His body "in three days" He could also have meant within three days.
"So the Jews answered and said to Him, 'What sign do You show to us, since You do these things?' Yah'shua (Jesus) answered and said to them, 'Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.' Then the Jews said, 'It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?' But He was speaking of the temple of His body. Therefore, when He had risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this to them; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Yah'shua (Jesus) had said" (John 2:18-22, NKJV; cp. Mt.26:61; 27:40,63; Mk.14:58; 15:29).
I realise that some will find this explanation unsatisfactory. However, this does at least take into account all the Scriptures on the subject. If Yah'shua (Jesus) had been in the grave three days and three nights then you are in the impossible position of explaining why the Scriptures say six times that He would rise on the Third Day and not the Fourth. However you try to look at these passages, you are forced to accept that Messiah was less than three whole days in the tomb. And the only way you can account for that, we believe, is by employing the explanation we have given.
Comments from Readers
Objection: "The three days and three nights does not mean Yahshua was raised on the Fourth Day as He was placed in the Tomb at twilight on the Passover [of] 14th Nisan (Aviv) - Wednesday - and arose at twilight on the Sabbath..." (AK, Australia, 8 December 2011).
Reply: "If 3 full days and 3 full nights were completed before Yah'shua rose, it would mean that He would then have been raised on the fourth day since the first 3 days and nights - or first three 24 hour days - would have been completed and past. Yah'shua did rise after the Sabbath... only, it was after the High Sabbath (The first day of Chag haMatzah, the Feast of Unleavened bread, on 15 Aviv - the day the priests were rushing to be done as mentioned in John 19:31), on 16 Aviv, Yom Bikkurim - the Feast of Firstfruits, with Yah'shua fulfilling that as Father Yah's first fruit of the resurrection. Josephus, historian from the time, recorded and left records that Yom Bikkurim / Feast of First Fruit always happens on 16 Aviv after the High Sabbath of the first day of Chag haMatzah! (DP, South Africa, 8 December 2011).
Objection: "John 11:9 Are there not twelve Hours in a day? Yahshua's Words.. Destroy this Temple …on the 14th Nisan... and In three days I will raise it up… Exclude the 14th .. Yahshua said Three days & Three nights "IN THE TOMB"… so .. starting 15th He would be raised on the 17th at twilight "within the three days".. He waited for the disciples and Mary to witness the Empty tomb and then presented Himself as the Wave Sheaf Offering which always followed the Weekly Sabbath … so you see it fits in without the Creation Calendar of starting the day in the morning… "The evening and the morning was the first day"…" (AK, Australia, 16 March 2014).
Reply #1: "I dealt with that translation error in an earlier article - scroll down to Appendix 1 where you'll see how this error was introduced (CCMW, Sweden, 27 March 2014).
Reply #2: "AK, I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say – could you clarify that for me?
We should note that where Scripture records Yah'shua speaking clearly and unambitiously about His death and resurrection He never said said '3 days and 3 nights', but rather, it was always 'within three days' or 'on the third day' (Matt.15:23; 16:21; 17:23; 20:19; Mark 9:31; 10:34; Luke 9:22; John 2:19).
Also, In the Hebrew mindset and way of counting, they would have counted the day the event had happened on as 'Day 1', and counted on from there, in contrast with how we have come to count with the Western mindset, where the day the event would have happened would be 'Day 0' and we would only count 24 hours later as 'Day 1'.
So if we took this understanding (and go from the 'sunset-to-sunset' model of reckoning days), it would go:
This would mean (if we were using sunset-to-sunset reckoning) that Yah'shua would have risen after the night of 17th Aviv. The problem with this is it would have meant that His resurrection would have missed the prophetic marker that Yom haBikkurim (The Feast of First Fruits) is meant to represent – namely, Him, the First fruit of the Resurrection, being raised and offered to Father Yah's glory. Scripturally Yom haBikkurim is always on the 16th of Aviv, the first day after the High Shabbat (as confirmed by Josephus).
- 14th Aviv day [Pesach – Yah'shua is put to death] = Day 1
- 15th Aviv Night = Night 1
- 15th Aviv Day [High Shabbat] = Day 2
- 16th Aviv Night = Night 2
- 16th Aviv Day [Yom haBikkurim – Feast of First Fruits] = Day 3
- 17th Aviv Night = Night 3
What about if we look at it from the understanding that Yah'shua had to rise within (less than) 3 days, or that He would rise again on the 3rd day (Matt.16:21; 17:23; 20:19; Luke 9:22; 18:33; 24:7; 24:46; Acts 10:40; 1 Cor.15:4), taking into account sunrise-to-sunrise reckoning and Hebrew counting?
This would fit with the accounts of Scripture, and how the women went to check the grave early on the first day after the High Shabbat (after the sun had risen) to find the grave empty and to meet Yah'shua. My own understanding is that Yah'shua was risen at about sunrise of Yom haBikkurim, because the sun itself was created to be a prophetic marker of what YHSH would do as the Sun of Righteousness! Think of seeing the sun set – 'dying' and being 'buried' on the horizon... yet, with sunrise, the image of the sun 'rising from the grave' of the horizon, to Light everything from Strength to strength!
- 14th Aviv day [Pesach – Yah'shua is put to death] = Day 1
- 15th Aviv Day [High Shabbat] = Day 2
- 16th Aviv Day [Yom Bikkurim – Feast of First Fruits – Yah'shua rises from the grave] = Day 3
Incidentally, the sun as prophetic marker confirms sunrise to sunrise reckoning: First Sunrise = Birth, Sunset = Death, next Sunrise = Resurrection... There must always be a birth before there can be a death !
Hope this helps! Blessings!" (DP, South Africa, 28 March 2014)
Counter-Objection #1: "My main point regarding this is the Timing of Yahshua's death… if you say that the Jews had the wrong timing of the sabbath and Feasts, then why did Yahshua fulfil the Prophecies on the day that the Jews celebrated the Passover!!! That doesn't make sense! CCMW has never answered this question directly" (AK, Australia, 29 March 2014).
Reply #3: "Actually I did answer this question directly, AK, several times, in pointing out that multiple calendars were in operation in the first century AD (the Pharsees and Sadducees, for example, operated calendars that differed by a day, from what scholars have been able to deduce), including the correct one, depending which faction you belonged to (the Essenes seemed to use the so-called 'Enochian' system, whether in Jerusalem or in their Qumran community). Remember the Gregorian Calendar didn't exist at this time but the 8-day Julian one (with Saturday the first day of the week). Obviously the prophecies were fulfilled with those observing the correct calendar.
But that really is an academic point that doesn't alter the argument as a whole. You have to take all of the evidence that the Creation Calendar is the correct one into account which the modern Talmudic one did not and cannot. Those who defend the Talmudic system have to snipe at this bit of evidence or that without addressing the whole body of evidence together.
If you'd care to list the scriptures which you feel the Creation Calendar doesn't take into account, I'd be happy to look at each one in turn" (CCMW, Sweden, 29 March 2014).
Counter-Objection #2: "Cannot see it being Academic… Yahshua came through the Gates 10 days before Passover .. He ate the Passover lamb early and was crucified on the Passover day.. Had to be the correct Day to fulfil the prophecies..surely if there were Spurious Days being kept apart from the mainstream teachers of the day, they would be mentioned in the Tenach that this was the day that the Essenes kept or the Pharisees kept or whatever… There would have been conflict and differences… but nothing at all comes to light.. it seemed that all of Jerusalem was in Cinque with what was Happening to Yahshua that Day!" (AK, Australia, 29 March 2014).
Reply #4: "The Scriptures focus on the person of Yah'shua and everything around Him that pointed to Him - they do not deal with every heresy that abounded in His day, as today, except where such a heresy came into direct conflict with His teaching. All references to Passover would obviously have been pointing to the correct moed and not to the false dates of the other factions. We know that these factions existed historically - it's established fact - but the fact the the Scriptures nowhere mention them is not proof that they did not exist. Nothing, for example, is said of the Sadducees denying the Nevi'im (Prophets) and Kethuvim (Writings) anywhere in the NT but that doesn't alter the fact that they did though we can make deductions that they did because of the Scripture Yah'shua used (for example) in defending the resurrection - He could have quoted the more definitive passages from the Nevi'im but chose rather to quote from the only corpus of Scripture which they accepted, namely, the Pentateuch. So arguments of silence can't be taken as first-line evidence of anything.
The differences and conflicts between Pharisees and Sadducees are hinted at everywhere but the Scriptures purposefully do not make them the centre of attention, but rather Yah'shua. Even Passover isn't at the centre but rather the Passover Lamb. So the majority unquestionably followed the right system - what scholars call the "Palestinian Calendar" as opposed to the "Babylonian Calendar" which many of the leaders were starting to use.
I am not in any case here to "win an argument". Those who want to know the truth will seek and find it. If we're honest with ourselves we have all had agendas in defending one system of another. For myself, nothing would please my flesh more to be wrong and to return to the Talmudic system because it would be much easier and more convenient for everyday life in the world as well as being 'nice' to have more friends in the Messianic Movement because most messianics accept the Talmudists. So if the evidence was convincing that the Talmudic system was right, I'd embrace it in a trice. However, it is not, and I prefer the fleshy inconveniences of the truth to what I now overwhelmingly believe is the true system. Further, I believe this is based on intelligent faith (reasoned, fact-based faith) which is why I have written so much material on the subject.
We could 'wrestle' hoping to have the 'last word' but I don't think either of us wants to do that. Like I said, if you want to bring up Scriptural material I have not covered, I'd be more that delighted to examine it. In the meantime, I have not been able to find a shred of evidence that the Bible supports any of the 10 contentions - I have dismantled these in my many articles:
To defend the Talmudic system you have to prove most of the above. I guarantee that is impossible. You would also have to show me why EVERY single biblical sabbath that is dated ALWAYS falls on the 8th, 15th, 22nd and 29th days of the month and NEVER any other - http://www.nccg.org/642Art-SabbathDays.html . Indeed, those serious about trying to defend the Talmudic Calendar have an IMPOSSIBLE talk which is why discussions with Talmudists always end with them either sniping at one of two items on the periphery or name-calling.
- 1. The calendar is calculated using only the sun (solar calendar);
- 2. Months contain only 30 or 31 days (with one containing 27 or 28);
- 3. There are 365 days in a year;
- 4. Days begin and end at either midnight or sunset;
- 5. Months begin at the sighting of the first crescent moon;
- 6. The moon is 'sick' and has nothing to do with the calendar;
- 7. There is no such thing as a 13th month;
- 8. New Year starts 16 March because Jerusalem has 12 hours of daylight;
- 9. Psalm 104:19 says the sun fixes holy days when it says the moon does;
- 10. What Enoch & Jubilees say takes precedence over the Bible
I do believe the honest seeker will arrive at the Creation Calendar in the end ... once they have dealt with underpinning motives for clinging onto clearly false ones, as I did myself. I writhed and wriggled for a year before surrendering to the inevitable" (CCMW, Sweden, 29 March 2014).
Reply #5; "@DP...I love what you said: "Also, In the Hebrew mindset and way of counting, they would have counted the day the event had happened on as 'Day 1', and counted on from there, in contrast with how we have come to count with the Western mindset, where the day the event would have happened would be 'Day 0' and we would only count 24 hours later as 'Day 1'."
Now I know why I struggled a great internal conflict when in school learning maths...I was born with a Hebrew mindset!" (SP, Ireland, 29 March 2014)
Counter-Objection #3: "I really think you aren't getting what I'm talking about CCMW. It was obvious that the Romans acknowledged that it was the Jewish Passover… they also released a prisoner of the peoples choice that day as custom. The Temple was full of sacrificial animals .., Yahshua was there "in order that the prophecies be Fulfilled and the scripture be unbroken. If the Jews were wrong why would He fulfil the Erroneous times of the Jews and not fulfil the will of the Father?" (AK, Australia, 29 March 2014)
Reply #6;: "OK, I see where you are getting confused, AK. Were you aware that the Sadducees were in control of the Temple and the setting of the times of the moedim (festivals)? And were you aware that the Sadducees observed a Luni-Solar Calendar? The Pharisees, on the other hand, basically had control of political or civil affairs, and whilst they did not observe the Luni-Solar Calendar as they ought to have, subscribing instead to the evolving Babylonian version which would become the Talmudic Calendar of today (once the Sadducee faction lost control of religious matters following the Diaspora). That is how the trandsition from Luni-Solar to Talmudic Solar Calendar took place. Kenneth Frank Doig explains:
So that is why the Judeans followed the minority (though Biblical) Luni-Solar Calendar so that prophecy would, as you correctly pointed out, be fulfilled. Though the majority Pharisees used a false calendar, becase of a political agreewment between the two dominant sects (Phariseeism and Sadduceeism), the Sadducees had control of the Temple and the calendar, not the Pharisees.
"A lack of understanding, or misunderstanding, of the variations in the ancient calendars of the Middle East has led to differing chronologies and interpretations of history based on Scripture and contemporary historical documents. An understanding of the building blocks of chronology is essential to accurate historical inquiry. This preliminary study begins with the present western calendar and then steps back to the opening of Genesis. The calendar systems will then be followed forward in time to the Bar Kokhba revolt in the second century CE and the later establishment of the modern Jewish calendar.
"The calendar system decreed by God to Moses was with the day beginning at sunrise and the new year beginning in the spring. The Sadducees used this luni-solar calendar. This was the calendar used by the priests at the Jerusalem Temple when Jesus entered its courts. The Sadducees controlled the Temple in Jerusalem, and the Jewish festivals were observed according to this calendar. (B.J.Malina, Christ and Time: Swiss or Mediterranean?, CBQ 51 (1989), 22-23 notes, "From the viewpoint of cyclical traditional time, the temple city of Jerusalem was one big clock marking time solely and only for the Jews." It was in the interests of the ruling elite to maintain an unchanging social order which included a recurring traditional reckoning of time.)
"The Jewish "civil" calendar with the day beginning at sunset and the new year beginning in the fall had no official status in the first century CE. However, this calendar of the Pharisees is usually claimed as the calendar in use at the Temple. (For example, J. Jeremias, Jerusalem in the Time of Jesus (Philadelphia: Fortress Press, 1969), 264. F. Parise, ed., The Book of Calendars (New York: Facts on File, 1982), 14, projects the present Jewish calendar reckoning back to 2 CE). This calendar of the Diaspora appears in later Jewish documents such as the Mishna and Talmud. The rabbis who wrote these wanted to suppress the Second Temple calendar of the Sadducees.
"There was also a small minority of Essenes that decried both calendars and insisted on their Jubilee calendar. This solar calendar began with a spring new year and the day beginning at sunset. This calendar has also been used to explain the events of the week of Jesus' crucifixion. (S.Ruckstuhl, Chronology of the Last Days of Jesus (New York: Desclee, 1965)).
"The Herodian rulers counted their reigns by the Syro-Macedonian calendar, a luni-solar calendar that began the day at sunset and the new year in the fall. Alexander the Great brought this calendar to the east. This calendar was also the calendar used by Luke.
"In the first century CE the Roman conquerors of Judea used their new Julian solar calendar. Their year began January 1, and the day changed at midnight.
"The older Babylonian lunar calendar, with a spring new year and a sunset day, had mostly fallen into disuse. Travelling merchants would have brought a few more variations of calendars.
"Of particular interest here are the three versions of the Jewish calendar. These diverse calendars were the result of different interpretations of the same Scriptures, different traditions, and personal revelation. The Jews of two millennia ago disagreed as to their correct calendar. However, even from our late perspective it is possible to resolve some of these differences.
"The lunar calendar system used by the Jews before the Babylonian captivity and during the Second Temple period was significantly different from the present Jewish calendar. The year originally began in the spring and the day at sunrise, and the determination of the new month was by lunar observation. This is likely the calendar of Scripture, including the Creation, Flood, Exodus, Judges, Solomon's Temple and most often at the Second Temple. Today the Jewish year begins in the fall and the day at sunset, and a fixed formula predetermines the beginning of the month. The present Jewish calendar evolved through the influence of the agricultural calendar taken into the Diaspora, the Babylonian calendar, and the Syro-Macedonian calendar. The changes in the Jewish calendar will be discussed in relationship to these other calendars.
"Some chronological solutions to the dating of the life of Jesus are directly dependent on understanding the calendar in use. Was it the calendar used by the Temple priests, the Biblical writers or that whose story is being told? The solution to dating the New Testament cannot be made without that understanding." (Kenneth Frank Doig, New Testament Chronology, (Lewiston, NY: Edwin Mellen Press, 1990)).
This information is easily verifiable. Thus your last objection to the truthfulness of the Soli-Lunar Creation Calendar being Yahweh's true calendar is removed" (CCMW, Sweden, 29 March 2014)